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User avatar
By Shifted
#42040
Without having done a lot of research, it looks like new half shafts for an '87 are around $800. I didn't see any remanufactured options off hand, but they must be out there. For CV joints, it looks like they are around $150 just for the joint.

So, what are the options, other than a brand new axle? I prefer quality remanufactured since I don't normally enjoy messing with CV joints. The ones that I have experience with are a royal pain. I have a leak from the clamp on one of the inner boots. The boot itself is fine. But, if I'm going to mess with it, I'd rather not have to mess with it again for a long time. Rather than just reclamp the boot, I'd like to consider replacing both half shafts or rebuilding them myself.
User avatar
By worf
#42055
I've seen receipts from shops that charged the new price for a rebuilt and kept the core charge (so... $1000 per axle.)

IIRC rebuilds from Mark are $350-ish each, exclusive of core charge. I've done many over the years and have no non-trivial complaints. (I'd like the clamps to be cad plated... :silenced: )

If you've got a torn boot that tore last week (as opposed to N years and umteen-thousand miles because checking boots every year isn't a thing) and you are paying yourself, then a boot kit or four makes sense.

Else, not.

On several occasions with known low-mileage 1/2-shafts with just-torn or dry-rotted boots, I've had the client save ~500 bucks by suggesting they come over and do the dirty work involved in boot replacement. I hand them a stool, a bucket, three cans of brake clean, a big fan, etc. and sit them outside... When they're done I waltz over with the Oetiker clamp pliers(*).

Most of the time they listen when I tell them not to let the balls fly loose.

(*) No. Never that easy. But a man can fantasize.

For my 928s, if I've got two torn boots on one 1/2 shaft or if it's the outer boot, fuck it. I'll get a rebuilt; I don't pay myself enough to clean CV joints.
Crumpler liked this
User avatar
By SeanR
#42068
I've rebuilt dozens upon dozens of them. Easy but dirty to do and I usually charge 2 hours per side to do so. Over the years I've had a couple cars that had vibrations and we went through everything possible to eliminate that vibration. The last 3 cars that had nagging vibrations, the only solution was to replace the axles and that only came about after everything else was done. Engine mounts, engine dampers, torque tubes, flywheels, balanced clutch components etc.

One car the owner said just to order new so I did and it was a night and day difference. Amazed at how it changed. 2nd car was mine and I didn't want to buy new (cheap ass) so contacted Mark and talked about his rebuild service. I'd not gone that route before because I figured all they did was what I do, which was cleaned them up and changed the boots. Nope, his guy takes apart the outer and does it properly. New joints/over sized balls if needed and does a proper rebuild. So I tossed those on and am very happy. 3rd car. the same. Used rebuilds and if it were not for a front transmission seal leaking he'd be very happy with the results. Reminds me, I need to take a trip to Tulsa and take a transmission out and reseal it.
User avatar
By Shifted
#42082
Thanks, I didn't know that 928 International had rebuilt half shafts. They list a 44 and 45 tooth version. Any way to tell which one I have without taking it out?

The boot on my CV joint is not torn. The grease is slipping out of the collar where the clamp is supposed to seal the boot to the end of the half shaft that bolts to the differential.

The grease was not leaking out a few months ago, no more than 500 miles but probably within the last 200. No unusual play in the joint that I can detect.

Crumpler gave me a crash course in removing the half shaft. Looks like it should be pretty simple. Remove wheel, spin the hub nut off, remove half shaft bolts on differential end, slide it out. Given the cost of rebuilt ones, I might as well just replace the boot on the only one that's leaking and leave it alone for now.

Looks like I need to get one of those fancy band clamp tools :)
User avatar
By Crumpler
#42089
Who here has forgotten to torque the six hex bolts to spec?
Besides me :)
Unique rear end flavor ensued.

Ok this is real: is the axle nut a single use, or did I make that up?
User avatar
By Fox_
#42090
Yeah, just "spin the hub nut off".

Hope you've got a hell of a breaker bar with 3/4" drive!

...as for the clamps... I use the same tool I have for PEX plumbing. :roflmao:

Clean the hell out of the holes for the hex drive nuts on the transmission and use loctite... I learned that lesson with the top caliper bolt on a greasy land rover. Loctite doesn't work very well in a greasy hole.
.
Last edited by Fox_ on Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
By SeanR
#42102
Remove your muffler and resonators to make it easier. Axle nut is around 320ftlb. Rest is gravy.

If you are only leaking from the boots where it clamps on, it's over filled and just wipe it off. No need to yank the axles and replace boots if the boots are not split.
User avatar
By worf
#42155
SeanR wrote: Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:13 pm ... nagging vibrations, the only solution was to replace the axles and that only came about after everything else was done. Engine mounts, engine dampers, torque tubes, flywheels, balanced clutch components etc.
This -^, BTDT. One client had been to several shops and had been chasing vibration for a couple of years. Wasn’t easy to diagnose but once two rebuilt axles were on it the difference was noticeable just driving on the driveway to pull on to the street.
... Mark and talked about his rebuild service. I'd not gone that route before because I figured all they did was what I do, which was cleaned them up and changed the boots. Nope, his guy takes apart the outer and does it properly. New joints/over sized balls if needed and does a proper rebuild.
And this.

I threw a set of Mark’s rebuilt’s on my ‘91 at 105-ish k-miles. Mine were factory originals.

Made a noticeable difference.

30-year old CV grease stopped being grease 10-15 years ago once the anti-wear package finished reacting with the base lubricant.
User avatar
By worf
#42203
Shifted wrote: Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:57 am Do you know what the story is with the 44 and 45 tooth versions?
Do I *know*? No.

However I will bet you one million times the cost of the long distance phone call(*) that 45 vs 44 is a typo. Clues abound on the shop.928intl web site.

* From your phone with an unlimited domestic long distance plan.
User avatar
By Shifted
#42209
I don't like to bother vendors unless I plan on buying from them. And since I plan to just reseal the existing half shafts, I don't want to waste his time with a call that is just to satisfy my quest for information.

However, a little digging revealed that the tooth count refers to the ABS ring. S4+ cars have less teeth on the ABS ring than earlier ABS cars.
User avatar
By worf
#42245
Shifted wrote: Tue Dec 15, 2020 10:16 am However, a little digging revealed that the tooth count refers to the ABS ring. S4+ cars have less teeth on the ABS ring than earlier ABS cars.
This is true. However, on the site there are two 86.5-95 axles. One rebuilt, one used but with different tooth count. The base part number is the same. PET shows one part for the axle for 86.5-95 and I have never, ever come across a whiff that there are two axles for 86.5-95.

Occam’s Razor: Typo.
User avatar
By worf
#42252
Shifted wrote: Tue Dec 15, 2020 12:58 pm:banghead:
LoL.
User avatar
By Shifted
#43058
Those are very nice. I've got a good bit of experience with locking tabs on half shaft bolts on another vehicle where the bolts will back out if you don't do the installation exactly by the book (and many owners/mechanics don't). I've never heard of the 928 half shaft bolts backing out, though. Have you had a problem with that?
User avatar
By SeanR
#43060
Shifted wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 5:42 pm Those are very nice. I've got a good bit of experience with locking tabs on half shaft bolts on another vehicle where the bolts will back out if you don't do the installation exactly by the book (and many owners/mechanics don't). I've never heard of the 928 half shaft bolts backing out, though. Have you had a problem with that?
I never have. Use the proper torque and forget about it.
User avatar
By worf
#43064
Shifted wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 5:42 pm ... the bolts will back out if you don't do the installation exactly by the book (and many owners/mechanics don't). I've never heard of the 928 half shaft bolts backing out, though. Have you had a problem with that?
Exactly once. About 12 years ago. Did a house call to rework. SOP(*) updated. No problems since.

(*) Always make sure the bolts are clean and dry. Or replace with new.

Of course SOP always included using a torque wrench and a ‘double triangle’ pattern after the bolts are arm tight.

It’s a lot of fun, all by yourself, counter-holding the hub while you torque. Much easier with a helper to turn and hold the hub.
User avatar
By worf
#43077
maddog2020 wrote: Fri Dec 18, 2020 6:47 pm With 505 torque at the ground I had problems keeping them tight, and I also had issues with the crank bolt backing out. I always torque to spec and recheck . I’ve also seen high HP 930’s knock them loose.
Whole different ball game there.
User avatar
By Shifted
#43082
On the other type of vehicle where they tend to back out, they use nordlock washers and red loctite. If you don't use brand new nordlocks every time, or if the bolts have been over torqued and stretched, the bolts will back out, banging on the caliper adapter and eventually breaking off. Good times. But not as bad as the bolts that hold the caliper adapter backing out because the differential case is aluminum and everyone seems to over torque them when installing them, which strips the threads in the case, and you don't find out until you hear some very loud banging and then the caliper starts to fall off.

A couple of tricks that I use when doing half shaft bolts on my own depend on whether or not it's on a four post lift. If it's on a four post lift, I just lower the bridge jack to put enough weight on the tires to hold it in place. If it's on the ground, I'll use a board or two as a wedge between the tire and the ground. Or, if the tire is off, run a long crow bar through the lugs and rest it against the ground to stop it. If it's high enough off the ground, but not too high, I've even used a floor jack to lift up against the tire.

It should go without saying that any method that I use always ensures that if things go south, the vehicle won't fall on me. Which means either the tire is on and there is enough clearance for me to be under there with the car on the tire, or the vehicle is securely supported with jack stands. I don't see myself trying any of those on a two post lift, but I strongly dislike being under two post lifts for any kind of work.

I've had half shafts off on other vehicles so many times that I can't even begin to count. Easily into the hundreds. The 928 half shafts are so easy to do by comparison that it's not even worth mentioning.

I've got somewhere around 550 lb ft to the wheels, and no issues with my half shaft bolts backing out. Or anything else loosening up. Yet. Yes, I checked.

The locking tabs are cheap insurance. They won't ensure that things stay properly tight if the bolts have been stretched or not torqued properly, but they will make sure that the bolts don't back out and the half-shaft stays attached. In those cases, I like to mark the assembly so that if anything turns even a tiny bit, I can tell. Even with the locking tabs they can turn a tiny bit until the tab fully engages. And if I see something has turned, then that means it needs a new bolt and the two bolts on either side should be changed too, at a minimum.

That's just how I do things, for better or worse :)
User avatar
By Shifted
#45251
So, it turns out that the leak is because the shop that worked on the car before I bought it replaced one of the inner CV boots, but did it with the wrong part. The boot doesn't fit in the groove properly, and it's too long so they just clamped the small end at a random spot on the shaft. I'm surprised that it lasted as long as it did, but there is still plenty of grease in there and the joint looks fine. I'll disassemble it and put the correct boot on.

Just another thing to put on the list of improperly done work by the previous shop.
Last edited by Shifted on Sun Dec 27, 2020 8:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
By Shifted
#45259
BTW - two more points:

1) My halfshaft bolts were still tight. No issues with them backing out with the extra torque from the turbo.

2) This was the absolute easiest half shaft to remove that I have ever encountered. The axle nut was very tight, but so easy to access. My impact gun spun it off with no sweat. Back out three bolts on the half shaft, jack and spin the tire, back out the other three. Tap the axle out of the hub with a wood block and dead blow hammer. Done. Super super easy.
User avatar
By Shifted
#45810
Once I had the half shaft back in the hub, I ran the axle nut on with my impact just enough to get it tight. Then, I used my 600 ft lb 3/4" drive torque wrench to incrementally torque the nut. 200, then 250, then 300. Everything was going great. Until I set it to 337.5 (the closest increment my wrench has to 339). Then, this happened:
image.png
That's a 3/4" to 1/2" impact reducer. I've used it before for close to 500 ft lbs, but I guess it was finally fed up enough with my abuse to walk off on the job. I used my impact to turn the nut a little more, but I've got new tools on the way to make sure that it's properly torqued. Not just a new reducer, but also a set of deep well 3/4" drive sockets that include the 32mm axle nut size.

Other than that, this has been a very easy R&R.
User avatar
By worf
#45906
When you’re doing 3/4” work, there’s no substitute for 3/4” tools.
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