Welcome all 928 forum refugees!
User avatar
By jej3
#10847
No dog in the exodus from Rennlist NOR any opposition to this site BUT....

Why post here and not on the 928 Owners Club forums? If all of the contributors on RL "woke up" and said what I think they're saying which is "I can't believe I put so much of my knowledge in the hands of a third party", is this site any different?

I applaud creating a full RL alternative but for the 928 folks, just a simple "Why here and not post on the 928 OC Forums?"

Not meaning to offend but would like to understand.
User avatar
By SCX2132
#11043
Thanks for dropping in T. The OC does a lot of good work but their website needs serious attention. MAC OS (pretty much all I use) throws unsecured site warnings up on enough pages to keep me out of there. It is supposedly being worked on but I quit checking after about a year.

The OC has been full of great people doing a lot for the community for many years, hope they get this fixed one day. I’d love to contribute in that site as well.
User avatar
By sh944
#11054
Great question. I might be speaking over my head but I see this site as having an opportunity to become *the* 928 site and I am planning on talking with Ferdinand about how to make that happen. Stand by.

Again, you asked exactly the right question and I think we can provide the answer.
User avatar
By SeanR
#11057
I agree with those that have said over the years that the 928 OC should be where everyone goes to for 928 Tech questions and answers. Have always thought that, but since Rennlist already had all of it in a crappy search database, there wasn’t really a need to. I’ve not used the forums over there in a few years because it always seemed buggy and clunky. I know that jarrod is actively looking at ways to improve that but you run in to a couple of problems with it.

Traffic, there really isn’t any. To get the tech there, you need it. You also need people who are dedicated to building that data. Rennlist took 20+ years of people posting, asking, showing to build that database that is there. Lots and lots of people, some who have been there the entire time and a majority who drive by, ask a question and then disappear. It’s the way of forums and something that has been discussed behind the scenes here on what are we doing, what do we want to do.... should we be doing anything at all. After all, Rennlist is still there, still has the information and is still searchable.

From a personal standpoint, I don’t want to spend hours a day for the next couple years typing out and putting down what I know in to a forum. Will I answer questions as they come up? Sure can. Here or the OC (I think I need to re-up).

I came here because my friends got screwed over at Rlist and want to hang where they do, in the OT area. Linderpat said it best over there. That was where I kicked off my boots from a long day and hung out to read or chit chat, occasionally popping over to the 928 forum to see what was going on and what I could assist with if people smarter than I missed something. If people show up here or at the OC for guidance I’ll be happy to participate like I always have.
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User avatar
By jej3
#11121
sh944 wrote:Great question. I might be speaking over my head but I see this site as having an opportunity to become *the* 928 site and I am planning on talking with Ferdinand about how to make that happen. Stand by.

Again, you asked exactly the right question and I think we can provide the answer.
I don't know who Ferdinand is but he sounds like he's the owner of this site?

I mean no offense, but you won't have provided an answer. Until it is explained how this site is different than the "3rd party" status of "IB/JohnD"?

I appreciate the OC has tech issues (like the Mac ones mentioned) and I fully admire former RL'sdesire to stay close to the people whom are their friends. There's no ability or desire to create an OT/P&C like RL on the 928oc site. So if that's why people are here for that little bit of "forum fix", so be it.

So, what makes an investment of someone's time answering questions here GOOD for the 928 community? The investments of time people poured into RL was good for JohnD and IB, helped the community to a point but what happens when the people leave?

I don't know you SH944 so I don't mean for this to feel like I'm targeting you but I really think my question is still open.
User avatar
By Sazerac
#11151
Actually, I can understand the question, but there is a big advantage to an open forum like RL and this one. You simply get more traffic and raise the likelihood of getting good discussions going.

I was considering joining the 928 OC around the time they acquired the old 928registry page. The way they locked the registry page up as soon as they got a hold of it demonstrated a kind of lack of openness and I ended my consideration of joining them.

I am much happier paying for a site like this or RL that is publicly searchable and attracts all sorts of people. I think it is also a better forum for people like Sean, GB, etc. that are selling products to the community precisely for the same reason.
User avatar
By SeanR
#11173
I found that so very annoying, and then changing it so you couldn't find your car w/o knowing production numbers or some other crap.
Sazerac wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:49 am Actually, I can understand the question, but there is a big advantage to an open forum like RL and this one. You simply get more traffic and raise the likelihood of getting good discussions going.

I was considering joining the 928 OC around the time they acquired the old 928registry page. The way they locked the registry page up as soon as they got a hold of it demonstrated a kind of lack of openness and I ended my consideration of joining them.

I am much happier paying for a site like this or RL that is publicly searchable and attracts all sorts of people. I think it is also a better forum for people like Sean, GB, etc. that are selling products to the community precisely for the same reason.
User avatar
By fpena944
#11175
jej3 wrote:No dog in the exodus from Rennlist NOR any opposition to this site BUT....

Why post here and not on the 928 Owners Club forums? If all of the contributors on RL "woke up" and said what I think they're saying which is "I can't believe I put so much of my knowledge in the hands of a third party", is this site any different?

I applaud creating a full RL alternative but for the 928 folks, just a simple "Why here and not post on the 928 OC Forums?"

Not meaning to offend but would like to understand.

Thought I'd jump in and just offer my two cents.

You're right, at this time there's no real advantage to posting here compared to the multitude of other sites that have a much longer history and an exponentially larger base of users. But what is different here is that since we are in the beginning stages we can build and mold this community to what it is that you all want.

Forums are great for conversations but one thing I thought RL couldn't really do so well with was archiving technical content. In a forum the conversation can go many different ways so when I wanted to use it as reference for a job I had to read through the whole thread and make sure that there wasn't relevant advice on page #45 of a 90 page thread.

What I'm currently starting to build is a reference database with tags for labeling articles, easy image identification, organization by several different categories, superior search capabilities, and easier usage on mobile devices. Think the next-generation of Pelican's how-to articles.

I'm hoping this type of arrangement will help make it easier to find what is needed but still keep conversations flowing naturally. Again, all conceptual as in the process of being built but I hope when done we'll have a functional community that provides a service where others might just fall a bit short of achieving.

Thanks for joining, let me know if there is anything I can help with!
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User avatar
By jej3
#11194
fpena944 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:52 am
Thought I'd jump in and just offer my two cents.

<snip>

Thanks for joining, let me know if there is anything I can help with!
Thank you, @fpena944 I just don't think the fundamental answer of content ownership which is part of my question, has been addressed.

I greatly admire the "build a better mousetrap" mentality but curious what keeps this site from getting scooped up again in X years?

They've got a ways to go and but I think the 928OC needs to provide the proper platform for technical content, which could and should be preserved.

I also think sites like this are great ways to socialize the existence of technical references like what MIGHT exist at some point on an Owners Club site like 928oc PLUS this site should support the camaraderie across models, etc...

I believe your plans are ambitious and great. I just think clarity and proactivity around the longevity of technical content, is a good thing to plan up-front.

Cheers!
User avatar
By fpena944
#11203
jej3 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:04 am
fpena944 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:52 am
Thought I'd jump in and just offer my two cents.

<snip>

Thanks for joining, let me know if there is anything I can help with!
Thank you, @fpena944 I just don't think the fundamental answer of content ownership which is part of my question, has been addressed.

I greatly admire the "build a better mousetrap" mentality but curious what keeps this site from getting scooped up again in X years?

They've got a ways to go and but I think the 928OC needs to provide the proper platform for technical content, which could and should be preserved.

I also think sites like this are great ways to socialize the existence of technical references like what MIGHT exist at some point on an Owners Club site like 928oc PLUS this site should support the camaraderie across models, etc...

I believe your plans are ambitious and great. I just think clarity and proactivity around the longevity of technical content, is a good thing to plan up-front.

Cheers!
That's a great question and one that is difficult to respond in a way that will apply for all potential scenarios.

Not a legal expert by any means but would creating a special user license where all contributions are still owned by the contributor be something of interest? Or what about a paid content agreement where x # of content views nets a royalty of some sort?

Just throwing these out there but would like to discuss what would be fair to all of those involved. I know many of you have valuable experience and don't want someone else to reap the rewards by monetizing your efforts. So if there is a way to come to a mutually beneficial agreement then I'm all for it. Just not sure how to proceed as this is moving on to territory I'm not quite familiar with.
User avatar
By worf
#11208
fpena944 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:49 am
That's a great question and one that is difficult to respond in a way that will apply for all potential scenarios.


Just throwing these out there but would like to discuss what would be fair to all of those involved.
I think we have arrived at the point of your site’s evolution where its organizational structure, governance model and future need to be discussed and settled upon.

I have more thoughts on that but am presently due to technical limitations unable to expound on them (i.e. stupid marginally-disfunctional touch screen.)
User avatar
By SeanR
#11216
worf wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:11 am
fpena944 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:49 am
That's a great question and one that is difficult to respond in a way that will apply for all potential scenarios.


Just throwing these out there but would like to discuss what would be fair to all of those involved.
I think we have arrived at the point of your site’s evolution where its organizational structure, governance model and future need to be discussed and settled upon.

I have more thoughts on that but am presently due to technical limitations unable to expound on them (i.e. stupid marginally-disfunctional touch screen.)
Image
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User avatar
By fpena944
#11221
SeanR wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:21 am
worf wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:11 am
fpena944 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:49 am
That's a great question and one that is difficult to respond in a way that will apply for all potential scenarios.


Just throwing these out there but would like to discuss what would be fair to all of those involved.
I think we have arrived at the point of your site’s evolution where its organizational structure, governance model and future need to be discussed and settled upon.

I have more thoughts on that but am presently due to technical limitations unable to expound on them (i.e. stupid marginally-disfunctional touch screen.)
Image
It really did but I completely understand why!

I know those of you who contribute don't want to end up in the same type of situation you just left. I'd like to work together to come up with a solution that is suitable for all.
User avatar
By worf
#11240
I wanted to be succinct not ominous. Nevertheless...
User avatar
By worf
#11243
I’ve got to get back to my backlog of client work. I’ll try to gather my thoughts during the day and follow up this evening.
User avatar
By linderpat
#11262
Should probably cut and paste these last few threads into a new stand alone thread in the Diner, so that everyone can chime in. Interesting stuff to consider, and lots of legal work behind it (it is one of the things I do - lots of web User Agreements involving content ownership). The legal considerations are not simple, and the effort is not cheap. I do know that I have no issue with IB having a license to my contributions over the years, even though such contributions are meager compared to Dave, Sean and many others. I stand by my view that I'm fine with Rennlist for the technical stuff, due to the sheer magnitude and history that is there, and the practical issues of trying to recreate it elsewhere. It does not matter to me who else gets to use it. And for many others, there is real value gained by having your tech advice on renny and similar forums - you get lots of exposure on a very wide basis. I don't know if you can easily measure that level of advertising and monetize it, but it is there, and it has been very valuable to those who work on these cars for a living. Fernando, I would probably not want to go down this pipe too far if I were you. There is a reason why all websites like these set up the IP the way they do (for forums). I'd be happy to have a gratis call with you on the legal issues if you'd like, just send a PM.
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User avatar
By worf
#11271
linderpat wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 12:51 pm Should probably cut and paste ...
I'm just "in" because I needed to shoot off an order to Roger.

A separate thread in The Diner is a good idea. That was to be my first follow-up suggestion.

Also, I think we'd all benefit from an executive overview of the legal issues vis-a-vis content. On that note, non-exclusive license is obviously, to me at least, the place to start.

A balance between content retention for site value and ability to revise posts for non-nefarious purposes needs to be struck. Theoretically this is achievable via a 'wiki-like' mechanism where by edit history is retained. I do not know the level of technical effort required implement such a feature on this board's base code. (I do understand the technical difficulty: It isn't technically difficult. But, the effort involved to implement and test is likely not practical in the short term.)

Other random thoughts while I'm here:

The "El Jefe's site" business model won't work in the long run. Eventually the time, pressure and expense will drive the site the same way it did JD with the original Rennlist. I favor a model where those pressures are relieved by design. In general: a user-funded, user-governed, transparent model with advertising as a boost to revenue but not dominating it. Not all effort expended to maintain and evolve the site can be expected to be done by unpaid volunteers. Thus, some mechanism to compensate people for their time must be included in the design as well a way to engage some subset of the users as stakeholders.
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User avatar
By worf
#11272
And of course, there are issues that revolve around the various right-to-be-forgotten regulations. These will need to be dealt with sooner rather than later one way or the other. Best to have a plan for action before action is required.
User avatar
By fpena944
#11316
jej3 wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:24 pm @fpena944 , you realize you moved it to a private area where only paying members can access.

Feeling more like RL all the time :)
I just gave you access. Please join us so we can discuss there as it's an important topic to the overall user base of this forum and I don't believe the majority visit the 928 board.
User avatar
By billvv
#11349
SCX2132 wrote: Sun Aug 23, 2020 8:25 pm Thanks for dropping in T. The OC does a lot of good work but their website needs serious attention. MAC OS (pretty much all I use) throws unsecured site warnings up on enough pages to keep me out of there. It is supposedly being worked on but I quit checking after about a year.

The OC has been full of great people doing a lot for the community for many years, hope they get this fixed one day. I’d love to contribute in that site as well.
The OC is upgrading its site and that should be fixed soon.
User avatar
By billvv
#11354
Sazerac wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:49 am I was considering joining the 928 OC around the time they acquired the old 928registry page. The way they locked the registry page up as soon as they got a hold of it demonstrated a kind of lack of openness and I ended my consideration of joining them.
Anyone can view Registry entries, and any owner can add their car to the Registry. Perhaps you are trying to access the old Registry. All of those cars have been transferred to the new Registry on the OC site through the hard work and many hours of several volunteers.


SeanR wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:45 am I found that so very annoying, and then changing it so you couldn't find your car w/o knowing production numbers or some other crap.
Easiest way to find your car is ... 'Registry'>'Search/Enter/Edit Registry Entry by VIN' It takes you right to your car.
Last edited by billvv on Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
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User avatar
By linderpat
#11475
^^^Not quite - it's kind of wonky. The last 4 digits of my car are 0834, for a 1978 car. Last time I checked, I couldn't search based on the last 4 of my VIN, like we could the old registry.
User avatar
By billvv
#11505
linderpat wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:17 pm ^^^Not quite - it's kind of wonky. The last 4 digits of my car are 0834, for a 1978 car. Last time I checked, I couldn't search based on the last 4 of my VIN, like we could the old registry.
Not sure I understand... pretty sure all the years except some of the GTS's had VINs with the last 4 digits of 0834, so that search would pull up all of them. For 1978 that made your car the 824th US car produced that year (subtract 10 from last four of VIN. For '82 you have to subtract 50 and from then on subtract 60.) I entered 9288200834 in the Search/Enter/Edit link and found your beautiful blue car.
User avatar
By linderpat
#11535
billvv wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 12:44 am
linderpat wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:17 pm ^^^Not quite - it's kind of wonky. The last 4 digits of my car are 0834, for a 1978 car. Last time I checked, I couldn't search based on the last 4 of my VIN, like we could the old registry.
Not sure I understand... pretty sure all the years except some of the GTS's had VINs with the last 4 digits of 0834, so that search would pull up all of them. For 1978 that made your car the 824th US car produced that year (subtract 10 from last four of VIN. For '82 you have to subtract 50 and from then on subtract 60.) I entered 9288200834 in the Search/Enter/Edit link and found your beautiful blue car.
That's fantastic. Last time I tried I couldn't figure it out. The whole subtraction thing had me flumoxed. If all I need to do is enter my full VIN to get my car, then I'm fine with that. However, if scrolling, I prefer to see the last 4 VIN digits rather than the production order, which in the Porsche world, can be wrong.
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User avatar
By worf
#11564
linderpat wrote: Tue Aug 25, 2020 7:36 am That's fantastic. Last time I tried I couldn't figure it out. The whole subtraction thing had me flumoxed. If all I need to do is enter my full VIN to get my car, then I'm fine with that. However, if scrolling, I prefer to see the last 4 VIN digits rather than the production order, which in the Porsche world, can be wrong.
I’ve never been able to find any of my 3 928s on the new Registry by any means except sorting by color and scanning until I see a thumbnail of a picture I uploaded to the old Registry. I searched by VIN for our ‘94 a week-ish ago when her twin was on BaT. Nada. Bupkis. zEro. When I found it by mark-one-eyeball color search... sure enough correct VIN.

Thus, I find reports that search works dubious.
User avatar
By Landseer
#11929
OP asked why not post to OC.

In past it was always a control freak culture. Too closed. Contributions at one point had to be vetted. Joined a couple times. I tried multiple times to like it. Multiple times to register cars. Not going there again unless it becomes fully open, attracts others and becomes a lot less business serious and a bit more fun and frivolous.

I've made about 10,000 hobbyist posts on RL since 2007. Bunch on pelican too. Some on reutterwerk. Many asked for help. Some actually helped others. Hard to pull away, but anticipate keeping one toe in. I know what is there and might want to access archives. Will do that so long as google search gets me there. RL search is so bad it devalues the archives almost entirely.

But am here now, Open Road. This is my new home base. Last week I set up a new garage space north of Richmond for working on sons and my cars. A 951 and four mid year 928s. We sold the sub-2000 mile 944S2, btw.

Have been out of commission for several years due to health challenges, layoff and apartment life. Glad to be back. Couple of the cars are still in Indiana, headed there to pick them up before frenzy.

Thank you for setting up this site, adding 928 forum and enabling posting tech threads. Will begin with some posts about sorting out 86 auto in prep for frenzy. It's got some problems staying running.
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User avatar
By linderpat
#11939
Landseer wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:38 am OP asked why not post to OC.

In past it was always a control freak culture. Too closed. Contributions at one point had to be vetted. Joined a couple times. I tried multiple times to like it. Multiple times to register cars. Not going there again unless it becomes fully open, attracts others and becomes a lot less business serious and a bit more fun and frivolous.

I've made about 10,000 hobbyist posts on RL since 2007. Bunch on pelican too. Some on reutterwerk. Many asked for help. Some actually helped others. Hard to pull away, but anticipate keeping one toe in. I know what is there and might want to access archives. Will do that so long as google search gets me there. RL search is so bad it devalues the archives almost entirely.

But am here now, Open Road. This is my new home base. Last week I set up a new garage space north of Richmond for working on sons and my cars. A 951 and four mid year 928s. We sold the sub-2000 mile 944S2, btw.

Have been out of commission for several years due to health challenges, layoff and apartment life. Glad to be back. Couple of the cars are still in Indiana, headed there to pick them up before frenzy.

Thank you for setting up this site, adding 928 forum and enabling posting tech threads. Will begin with some posts about sorting out 86 auto in prep for frenzy. It's got some problems staying running.
Great to hear things are settling down for you Chris. Looking forward to catching up at Frenzy. It may not be as well attended this year, but it will be a badly needed relief valve for those of us who do go.

As to Frenzy, there was sad news about Bruce Bade passing away yesterday. Bruce was a good guy. I really got to know him down there. You can see his picture on rennlist in the Frenzy thread if you can't remember him, but you'll know who he was. I didn't know how accomplished he was until I read his obit. Wow. He'll be missed.
User avatar
By SCX2132
#11954
Landseer wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:38 am OP asked why not post to OC.

In past it was always a control freak culture. Too closed. Contributions at one point had to be vetted. Joined a couple times. I tried multiple times to like it. Multiple times to register cars. Not going there again unless it becomes fully open, attracts others and becomes a lot less business serious and a bit more fun and frivolous.
I think you nailed it Chris.

OC culture in general is stuck in the 90s, at least technologically, no Facebook presence, no Instagram presence, klunky website, etc. I (and others) have tried for the past year with my personal contacts on the board to get them into the 21st century with this stuff. If one does the math OC has enough members to have enough money to pay professionals for web work and possibly social media marketing. Just go on FB and count the number of 928 groups and members around the world...Global interest in this model is mind boggling. OC could have thousands of members.

Right here in our collective faces we've watched Fernando BUILD a website and fix dozens of bugs in about three weeks.

As I alluded to earlier in the thread, I know some OC board members, I have a lot of respect for them, and my comments are meant to be in a constructive spirit. I would love to see OC thrive.

....and by the way Chris, thanks again for finding that car for me :D
Attachments
928_number_one_11359812472_3bdd63a15ea14edf1befe553a4b4272874ba7c7c.jpg
number_one_porsche_928_cl_for_sale_ad_9288100011_32335822c32c482245de0d578fa4cc44c1ff2bf7.jpg
User avatar
By fpena944
#11958
You guys are awesome and I really appreciate the support!

You know I never realized just how devoted 928 fans were to their cars! It's tempting me to run out and find one just so I can be a member of this club!

I'm working on the tech portion of the site right now. If anyone has any compiled contributions they want to post on there please let me know. It's going to be a separate section but will be referenced within this forum. Just to start I'm going to post model information to demonstrate how it all works. But if we want to pre-fill it with anything that would be ideal.

More to come soon!
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By SCX2132
#11984
billvv wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:47 pm
Sazerac wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:49 am I was considering joining the 928 OC around the time they acquired the old 928registry page. The way they locked the registry page up as soon as they got a hold of it demonstrated a kind of lack of openness and I ended my consideration of joining them.
Anyone can view Registry entries, and any owner can add their car to the Registry. Perhaps you are trying to access the old Registry. All of those cars have been transferred to the new Registry on the OC site through the hard work and many hours of several volunteers.


SeanR wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:45 am I found that so very annoying, and then changing it so you couldn't find your car w/o knowing production numbers or some other crap.

Easiest way to find your car is ... 'Registry'>'Search/Enter/Edit Registry Entry by VIN' It takes you right to your car.
Old registry? Maybe the source of the problems... the first result of a google search of 928oc is "928registry":
Screen Shot 2020-08-26 at 9.12.07 AM.png
Then clicking on that produces this:
Screen Shot 2020-08-26 at 9.13.42 AM.png
Once in the site, by choosing a different google result "928oc.org", the "current events" menu item also sends you to "928registry"
Screen Shot 2020-08-26 at 9.23.45 AM.png
So, if I'm a new guy to the OC, and I google it I have to fight my way in. The events page link, which I think we all consider to be important, continues to not only be broken but throws a scary message back.

Could "old registry" web links be the cause of all of the problems? Sorry but I just can't see why this cannot be fixed over the YEARS.
Attachments
Screen Shot 2020-08-26 at 9.22.50 AM.png
User avatar
By Landseer
#11985
If Dwayne would allow us to upload his masterful tech articles onto Open Road it would be a great boost to this 928 tech section. I think they were housed as Dwayne's Garage, maybe in a NorCal porsche forum. Content was kind of akin to the old Clark's garage that 944 guys relied upon, but heavy with pics and detailed steps like a college level engineering lab report.
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By fpena944
#11996
Landseer wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 9:37 am If Dwayne would allow us to upload his masterful tech articles onto Open Road it would be a great boost to this 928 tech section. I think they were housed as Dwayne's Garage, maybe in a NorCal porsche forum. Content was kind of akin to the old Clark's garage that 944 guys relied upon, but heavy with pics and detailed steps like a college level engineering lab report.
Ideally this type of content should be posted in multiple places to make sure it lasts for all eternity and isn't lost when a site goes down.

I don't mind giving credit where it's due and linking back to the source of all the knowledge. Then let the user decide which environment is most comfortable for them and which community they prefer to interact with.
User avatar
By worf
#12102
fpena944 wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 8:28 am I'm working on the tech portion of the site right now. If anyone has any compiled contributions they want to post on there please let me know. It's going to be a separate section but will be referenced within this forum. Just to start I'm going to post model information to demonstrate how it all works. But if we want to pre-fill it with anything that would be ideal.
I'll see about posting my 928 PPI guide once I see this "tech portion."

I assume you've solved the xx? MB upload problem. If not, then I'm screwed as the PPI is like 35 MB.
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By billvv
#12331
SCX2132 wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 9:30 am Old registry? Maybe the source of the problems... the first result of a google search of 928oc is "928registry":
We have been seeing that behavior recently due to a Certificate issue with '928registry.928oc.org' and are working to fix it. If you use just the http:928oc.org URL you won't get that error. For some reason, Google wants their search to show the 'registry link'

Worf.. I've fixed the link to 'Current Events', which had the 'registry' link. Thanks for pointing that out. Also, if you let me know the last four digits of your VIN, I can try and figure out why you can't reach your Registry entry..

SCX2132 mentioned that the OC website was stuck in the 90's, and I guess that's true. It's not true that the membership fees would allow hiring a professional full-time webmaster at this point, however. OC funds are currently and primarily spent on support for events and membership rewards.

Landseer wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 4:38 am OP asked why not post to OC.
In past it was always a control freak culture. Too closed. Contributions at one point had to be vetted. Joined a couple times. I tried multiple times to like it. Multiple times to register cars. Not going there again unless it becomes fully open, attracts others and becomes a lot less business serious and a bit more fun and frivolous.
Not sure what you meant about 'fully open', unless it's that some parts of the site are only available to the members. That content includes Dwayne's write-ups, by the way. Maybe all of that should be made available to everyone and perhaps that's what you mean by 'business serious'. I've always suspected (well hoped, at least) that people join and pay dues to support the idea of a club for owners rather than wanting to 'buy' content, get membership rewards, and contribute to the support of events.

It's great that RL/IB has re-instated folks and that this forum has been created for the real-time tech and 928 discussion that the community deserves.... it doesn't seem like the OC is needed for that right now. But there is a good case for the OC to host content that needs to be permanent. Or rather, to continue to host that content. There is a great deal of info, especially historical, on the site if one looks around. A searchable master VIN list, for example.

A little history of the Registry...
When Chuck was looking for someone to take over the Registry, after some other initiatives he ultimately decided to donate it to the Owners Club. We received the database but not the software to run it, so in order to keep it alive we needed to somehow transfer all of that data to a new platform . Luckily, a volunteer showed up with mad skills and created a system that allows anyone to self-register their 928 and add their photos and information. Then, through some SQL code and many hours spent by a cadre of volunteers, the 'Old Registry' data was reloaded into the new platform. A year or so later, we were able to incorporate the PET data, including options, to each of the Registry records. Finally, we acquired some Vin Decoder code and were able to integrate that into new code to create the 'Search/Enter/Edit' link that currently appears on the website.
User avatar
By SCX2132
#12358
billvv wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 2:05 am
SCX2132 wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 9:30 am Old registry? Maybe the source of the problems... the first result of a google search of 928oc is "928registry":
We have been seeing that behavior recently due to a Certificate issue with '928registry.928oc.org' and are working to fix it. If you use just the http:928oc.org URL you won't get that error. For some reason, Google wants their search to show the 'registry link'

Worf.. I've fixed the link to 'Current Events', which had the 'registry' link. Thanks for pointing that out. Also, if you let me know the last four digits of your VIN, I can try and figure out why you can't reach your Registry entry..

SCX2132 mentioned that the OC website was stuck in the 90's, and I guess that's true. It's not true that the membership fees would allow hiring a professional full-time webmaster at this point, however. OC funds are currently and primarily spent on support for events and membership rewards.
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User avatar
By fpena944
#12761
Landseer wrote: Wed Aug 26, 2020 12:21 pm Dwaynesgarage.norcal928.org

Check out a couple of these writeups!

My guess is he would allow hosting, one of us can reach out and ask. IIRC know he's a west coast IT pro.
Does someone have a contact for Dwayne's Garage?

I wanted to check with him and see if he would be ok with us mirroring his content on this site. We would of course still link back to the original site.

Article section is put together but now needs content. So I thought maybe his series would be a good start.

Thanks!
User avatar
By Sazerac
#12886
billvv wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:47 pm
Sazerac wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:49 am I was considering joining the 928 OC around the time they acquired the old 928registry page. The way they locked the registry page up as soon as they got a hold of it demonstrated a kind of lack of openness and I ended my consideration of joining them.
Anyone can view Registry entries, and any owner can add their car to the Registry. Perhaps you are trying to access the old Registry. All of those cars have been transferred to the new Registry on the OC site through the hard work and many hours of several volunteers.


SeanR wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 8:45 am I found that so very annoying, and then changing it so you couldn't find your car w/o knowing production numbers or some other crap.
Easiest way to find your car is ... 'Registry'>'Search/Enter/Edit Registry Entry by VIN' It takes you right to your car.
The explanation about the past was interesting, but no, I didn't find the new registry useable and couldn't find anything on it without immediately getting the error message that I had to be a member. In the end, I regretted not buying the site from Chuck and maintaining it as my contribution to the community.

Based on the botched job, there is no way I am going to contribute any post or knowledge to the 928 OC club now. My opinion of that organization has been rather shaped as a group of people who lock up information as a way of blackmailing people into membership.

I am a member of other 928 clubs, so please don't tell me I'm a cheap skate. I know those might be harsh words to a group of dedicated people, but I know none of them and this is just my impression from the outside. Perhaps you can relay the message in a more friendly way.

I welcome anybody like the founder of this site who tries to seek a compromise between donations and public sharing of such information on how to maintain and even improve our cars. The whole OT blow up over on RL might be the opportunity to fix this contradictory situation that always concerned me on RL.
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By billvv
#15207
Sazerac wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 6:52 pm The explanation about the past was interesting, but no, I didn't find the new registry useable and couldn't find anything on it without immediately getting the error message that I had to be a member. In the end, I regretted not buying the site from Chuck and maintaining it as my contribution to the community.
I am able to view the OC Registry without logging in, but there may be something about how it is set up that prevents you from viewing it. I'm glad to do what I can to make it more accessible for you and others that may have this problem. PM me if you like and we can pursue it.

Transferring Chuck's Registry was a huge task, given that the software that created it was not available, so the raw database and images had to be used as a basis for a new software framework. One of the primary enhancements is that it allows owners to add photos, etc., for their cars only, once registered on the site (no need to Join the OC). Another is that the information from the PET records is displayed for each registered car. I am sure there are improvements that can be made to the appearance and usability. If you would like to help with that, great!
User avatar
By linderpat
#15474
Hi Bill - I do appreciate all that you and the others do with the OC and site, but it is a challenge still to navigate, and now with a security overlay, even more steps are required to go from "room to room" on the site. I sent you n email.
User avatar
By billvv
#17644
After some detective work we discovered that our internet host, unbeknownst to us, had installed Cloudflare onto the 928OC account and set the security level to 'Under Attack'. I've reset that to 'Low' and it appears that the ubiquitous security challenges have gone away.

I can't explain why I never experienced those challenges while others did frequently, except to quote Cloudflare's screening methods....
There are several common reasons a Cloudflare-protected website displays a Captcha to a site visitor:

*The visitor’s IP address demonstrated previous suspicious activity online. Review your client IP address for malicious activity at Project Honeypot. If no suspicious activity is observed from the visitor’s IP address after a two-week period, Cloudflare stops challenging the IP address.

*The website owner blocked the country associated with the visitor’s client IP.

*The visitor’s actions activated a Web Application Firewall rule enabled by the website owner.
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User avatar
By Charlie
#18313
Dwayne's Garage is up and running as of 5 minutes ago at http://dwaynesgarage.norcal928.org. Bill Ball (who apparently runs norcal928.org) stated that he is hosting it in a Rennlist post . He has been easily available for PMs on Rennlist.

I have always been able to find my car on the registry by paging through the listings, but search is not too great and updating the record was a little wonky. Posting static material should theoretically be less complicated and easily found using Google. It would be good to have an archive on that site for the biggest and most common tech problems.

Rennlist shows no signs of ill health right now, and continues to supply the full archive of 928 technical info without logging in and via Google also.

One great reason to post here is the extreme responsiveness of Fernando. As the site grows that will be both harder to maintain and less necessary, but it's a tremendous help right now.
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User avatar
By Landseer
#18317
Major change on RL is that one particular tech expert has elected to share. Up til now, for many years, modis operandi was to tease and almost troll. Major positive shift if it sustains.

But I'm here now, RL is secondary.
User avatar
By Shifted
#18327
Landseer wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:13 am Major change on RL is that one particular tech expert has elected to share. Up til now, for many years, modis operandi was to tease and almost troll. Major positive shift if it sustains.

But I'm here now, RL is secondary.
I concur on all points. It was hard to share anything or ask questions on RL for a long time due to the nature of the responses. Kind of like real life, though. It's why I like living with a little space between me and the rest of the world :)
User avatar
By SeanR
#18328
Landseer wrote: Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:13 am Major change on RL is that one particular tech expert has elected to share. Up til now, for many years, modis operandi was to tease and almost troll. Major positive shift if it sustains.

But I'm here now, RL is secondary.
What have I been missing?
User avatar
By fpena944
#18338
Just a little plug here for our articles section (the 928 section is the engine photo on the bottom row):

pages/articles-home/

Yes it's empty, except for an article I copied from elsewhere to demonstrate functionality, but with that it is open and available for whatever you all feel like archiving here. If you scroll to the bottom of the page you'll see where you can submit your own content. Note that when I say content this could also mean videos, PDFs, etc.

I'm still working on the Terms/Conditions of the site to be updated but essentially I am providing the ability for the contributor to either edit or request their content be pulled indefinitely. So we'll never be able to hold content hostage or keep you from picking up what you contributed and hosting it elsewhere.

As with everything else, this is a shell of potential functionality so I'm open to suggestions to make sure that it is meeting user expectations.

Thanks to all for making this a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th home - your participation is appreciated!
User avatar
By Shifted
#18353
I really appreciate the option to post and retrieve articles. Especially if they are easily exportable to PDF for posterity.

Would it make sense for us, the 928 owners, to start a thread with a list of how-to's that we would like to see? That way, those who have the time and inclination can put them together, knowing that their efforts are desired and appreciated. Kind of a call to arms, rather than just waiting for someone to contribute content.
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